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JORDAN PETERSON:
I think that that's partly the result of
directed policy; so it's linked to the idea that there's something
wrong with masculinity; and so that the expression of masculinity should
be limited in all sorts of arbitrary ways. The fact that kids can't
really play at schools any more is a manifestation of that. The fact
that male behaviour is often diagnosed as Attention Deficit Disorder,
for example, is a manifestation of that. The elimination of competition
as a valid form of human interaction and the failure to recognise that
competitive sports, for example, are deeply cooperative in their fundamental
nature, as long as everyone is playing by the rules, obviously. So there's
that. That's a large part of it.
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TUCKER
CARLSON:So you're
saying that there's an organised -- not always explicit, but still organised
-- attempt to deemphasise masculinity, or to punish masculinity. Why?
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JORDAN PETERSON:
Because it's easy to mistake masculine competence for the tyranny
that hypothetically drives the "Patriarchy". It's part of
an ideological world view that sees the entire history of mankind as
the oppression of women by men, which is a dreadful way of looking at
the World -- a very pathological way of looking at the World. It's not
like men and women always get along -- any more than than men and men
get along, or women and women, for that matter. But, fundamentally,
human history is a cooperative enterprise and men and women have lifted
themselves out of the mire over millenia in their cooperative endeavour
and to describe that as centuries of the oppression of women by men
is an absolutely reprehensible ideological rewrite of history and it's
what's taught in the humanities and much of the social sciences at universities
and, increasingly, in the public education system. It's taken as an
unassailable fact.
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TUCKER
CARLSON: And you're
saying that this has bad consequences for the development of boys?
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JORDAN PETERSON:
Well, how could you feel good about that? I mean, if you're made
out to be a potential manifestation of "Rape Culture", if
you're part of "Toxic Masculinity", if your competitive drive
is regarded as part of a tyrannical impulse, if the heritage to which
you belong is regarded as an "Oppressive Patriarchy", then
how in the World are you going to step forward with confidence and shoulder
that -- what would you call it? -- that burden? Why would you? Why wouldn't
you just step aside and retreat, which is exactly what's happening?
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TUCKER
CARLSON: But if men
are so aggressive and bent on establishing a "Patriarchy", why
have they stepped back and allowed this to happen?
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JORDAN PETERSON:
Well, I guess that's a good question, isn't it? I don't know the
answer to that. I don't know if they are precisely allowing it to happen.
It's very insidious, the ideological movement that's driving this part
of the Radical Left -- part of the Radical Left, I would say. It's a
very insidious movement. It's not an easy thing to resist and a lot
of it occurs -- well, for example, it occurs in the school system, increasingly,
and it isn't clear what -- they're not men that are reacting to that
-- that's boys. It's not clear what they're supposed to do about it.
So.... hard to fight an ideological battle.
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TUCKER
CARLSON: It is, it
is hard. Finally, if you were to give parents of boys one piece of advice
for how, in their small way, they can fight against this trend, for the
sake of their own boys, what would it be?
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JORDAN PETERSON:
Well, I would say, first of all, encourage them, and I mean that
most deeply, is that to encourage someone is to instill courage in them,
to support their courage and that doesn't mean protect them from what's
dangerous. It means teach them how to be competent and teach them that
they can rely on themselves to prevail even in the darkest of circumstances.
That's part of it. I would say, as well, more specifically -- and this
is specific advice for parents -- if you have your children in a school
and they talk about "Equity" in this class and they talk about
"Equity", "Diversity", "Inclusivity",
"White Privilege", "Systemic Racism" -- any of that
-- you take your children out of the class. They're not being educated,
they're being indoctrinated and there's
absolutely no excuse for it.
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TUCKER
CARLSON: I agree
with that completely. You might run out of schools pretty quickly, though,
here in this country.
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JORDAN PETERSON:
That would be just fine!
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TUCKER
CARLSON: Jordan Peterson,
it's hard to express my gratitude to you for telling the truth, as you
do. Thank you very much for that!
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JORDAN PETERSON:
My pleasure!